British singer Leona Lewis (whose chart-topper “Bleeding Love” you’d definitely recognize) has been crowned PETA’s Sexiest Vegetarian:
Lewis—whose album Spirit made her the first British artist to top the U.S. Billboard chart with a debut album—has a squeaky clean history. And when it comes to the dirty business of animal abuse, she’s a woman of action. “I am vegetarian so I don’t have clothes, shoes or bags made from leather or suede or any animal products. … I’m on a mission,” she says.
Hold up.
That bag you see there on the right? It’s Prada. It costs $990, and it’s leather. Plus it has feathers — from birds.
And then there was the time in January when she went on MTV’s TRL and wore a leather jacket.
And before that, she didn’t seem to object when X Factor (which is kinda the U.K.’s version of American Idol) made her over and slapped a pretty slammin’ leather bomber on her.
Is this really the best PETA can do?
I guess I’m not as hip as I thought. I’ve never heard “Bleeding Love” and I have no idea who she is. She’s not very bright obviously.
Honestly, it’s like shooting fish in a barrel.
Don’t know about the US, but in Britain the way she is standing is called pigeon toed. Maybe that is why all the feathers.
To be fair, they said “sexiest vegetarian” — not “sexiest vegan.”
But then again, she’s not really all that “sexy” to begin with.
flirt… yep. Fish in a barrel. BANG.
Who?
I don’t know how to break this but …. see that bag? It’s a fake rip-off with no leather. You’ll find them available on street corners across the globe from a friendly though not strictly within the law street trader.
See those leather jackets? They’re plastic. She even wears fake UGG boots which contain no animal products.
It’s a little trick vegans and those on limited budgets play all the time. Artificial leather has been around for decades.
@John - We call it Pigeon Toed here as well. My uncle was born that way and they broke his legs as an infant so that he wouldn’t walk like that for the rest of his life, but I think she’s doing that on purpose, and it’s not cute.
Janice, you’re telling me an international superstar is buying knockoffs?
Rocko - afraid so my friend.
This girl is vegan serious so fails the hypocrite test on this one.
she seemed like a nice girl too, so this is too bad. it’s bad enough to say you’re a vegetarian when you have leather (and bird feather bags.. the hell?) products sitting in your closet. but when you speak out against it, and you’re caught? especially by deceiver.com?
yep, that’s a good one!
and i’m pretty sure this is the best PETA can do. sad isn’t it?
pasta - you’re hip, you visit deceiver.com!
and janice, yes faux leather has been around for a while, but how do we know for sure that it’s faux??
yeah rocko, i don’t know if a superstar would be buying knockoffs either.. i did one time, see parasite hilton with a fake louis vuitton. so you never know!
So she doesn’t eat meat, and more power to her. Whatever.
But it irritates me that she’s alledgedly worn leather and gets away with it. Maybe if PETA wasn’t so militant about what standards qualify as a “good” vegetarian, it wouldn’t annoy me. According to PETA, if you wear leather or fur, you are the scum of the universe, but I guess being a celebrity means that you’re exempt from the incrimination and scrutiny any average income individual would be forced to face.
You can cut the bias in the atmosphere with a knife when it comes to these people.
If that isn’t a popularity contest, I don’t know what is.
And anyone who hasn’t heard her music is better off that way. I’ve had the misfortune of hearing her song “Bleeding Love” several of times, and quite frankly, I think she sounds like a poor man’s Mariah Carey. I’ve never been into to that kind of music, but I know what a wannabe sounds like.
Unless you are an assittant for the sexy vegetarian, just how could you possibly know what those items are made of? I know speculation passes for fact in lib-land but…
WHy don’t you get in the barrel with her. There are some posters I’d like you to meet.
stop hating on leona just cause she’s pretty and if you haven’t heard of her u must be dumb
lulu, having not heard of someone, or having not heard them doesn’t make them dumb. I bet your brain is a vat of ignorance just based on that comment, and while I would say that you are dumb, it would be unfair. You are probably just 14. The two things look alike, but really aren’t…dumb and 14 that is.
Well she is smokin’ I’ll give you that.
If the author bothered to go to PRADA’s website (isn’t that what you do, you know, check your fatcs around here and put PETA on blast) they would have UNDERSRTOOD that it’s NOT a PRADA bag. PRADA don’t even USE feathers. <—–
And the bad is NOT EVEN FEATHERS…its pleather cut into strips. PRADA use leather cut into strips, also.
And that jacket is so pleather, you must not have stylists on staff.
I hope you call yourselves out and retract your false story, you know to show that you acknowledge your errors.
http://www.google.com/search?q=prada+feathers
Here’s last year’s version of the bag. Looks pretty similar to me. But I’ll ask our stylist, Carmello, just to be sure.
But I’ll humor you, since you know so much about high fashion. If Gill Hart got it wrong and Leona Lewis isn’t sporting a Prada bag, what is it?
The Oversneer - as I said before, it’s a fake …. she’s on record as saying she buys fake copies of various fashion items which contain animal products, for example in this article:
http://entertainment.timesonline.co.uk/tol/arts_and_entertainment/music/article2630762.ece
Do people really live that sheltered a life that they’re unaware that you’ve been able to pick up ripped-off designer goods for years, and that vegans/vegetarians wear pleather/faux leather copies of famous fashion names?
Here’s what I don’t get…vegans eat “mock” egg salad and wear pleather.
Why even go there? Is it because you miss the real thing so much you have to fake yourself out?
Why not just wear burlap and hemp and eat seeds to proudly proclaim your choice to go vegan?
Just a thought. Flame away.
Making fun of vegans/vegetarians/peta is usually pretty easy. And after all they’re kind of fun to pick on a little. But the (very) thinly concealed rage, and foaming at the mouth anger that Animal Lover, and Janice have just seems to make it much more fun. It’s just these kinds of almost unhinged reactions that turns people off to a lifestyle they might consider.
I was a vegetarian for two years. And knowing now the kind of people that inhabit that world I would never go back because I wouldn’t want to support this kind of lunacy. Have a drink, or maybe a hamburger. You need to calm down.
Pastafarian - I have always eaten meat and worn leather. Name the time and place and I’ll join you for that drink and hamburger (you’re paying though - I’d a bit tight on the money front). I think PETA are obnoxious in oh-so-many ways and deserve a lot of stick for the rubbish they continuously churn out.
However if you’re going to grab the Deceiver stick and start beating someone, make sure you have the right target. All I’ve defended here is Leona Lewis who is on the end of some pretty cheap and inaccurate accusations.
Up above katie says “how do we know for sure that it’s faux?” - tun that back around and we get “how do we know for sure that it’s leather?”. Without proof this article is entirely worthless, and given all available facts point to Ms Lewis wearing faux leather jackets etc I think it’s just a little bit unfair on the individual concerned.
If you’re going to go after PETA there’s no need to scrape the bottom of the barrel, the barrel’s full to brimming with plenty of juicy (and legitimate) targets.
Pasta, like you, I was a vegetarian, though I never became one out of anything like guilt about eating animals. While I don’t care what people do to their bodies, and have several vegetarian/vegan friends that are not like these irrational fanatics that couldn’t find a fact to support their rabid crusade if one actually existed. However, it’s these people that make the rest look bad. If I am donating to an animal charity these days, I make sure they have no association with terrorists like PETA. As for being a vegetarian again? Why? I was at my unhealthiest when I didn’t eat meat, and I was eating healthy foods the whole time because I never eat junk food anyway. And if I ever were tempted, like you, I wouldn’t because of those types of fanatics.
You’re right, I’m wrong. I’m sorry. As far as the proof is concerned, I am going to assume she’s a dim-wit and all of that stuff is leather. There it is in the picture. It looks much too nice to be fake. Virtually everyone I’ve asked here, I come here at work, agrees. Pleather simply doesn’t look that good. I don’t have to prove it’s real, she has to prove it’s fake.
Lots, and lots of great meat eating places here in Chicago, hog butcher to the world.
I honestly think that if you swear off fur/leather/feathers/meat because it is “evil” you should be aware of the other evils you are contributing to. Synthetic products are harmful to the environment. Real leather, fur and feathers break down, however, pleather takes years to breakdown and is toxic to the earth. So when PETA says to “go green go vegan” they are contradicting themselves. A lot of the vegan friendly meat-like substances (most of which aren’t good for you)are so chock full of chemicals that they aren’t even real soy anymore.
I think the issue here is that she swears off meat and leather then buys faux products. The problem with that is highlighted very well in these posts: no one can tell if it is real or not. So the problem then becomes, when people see her with her fake leather, will they know the difference? Probably not, but will they go and buy a bag just like it not caring what it’s made of?
now just for the record, i’m not a PETA lover or supporter and i do eat meat. but i know that in leather coats, formaldehyde goes into it to help it “stay nice” and im pretty sure that mcdonald’s puts that in their fries too. anyway, a lot of junk is put into leather and fur coats to keep it looking “nice” and so it doesnt decompose because it is a dead skin. faux leather/fur isn’t really harmful to the environment, but i won’t go into an al gore thing here. just saying..
I am amazed that people will go on about fake leather products being harmful to the environment when the very practice of eating meat is what is actually killing our environment.
Why do people talk without knowing?
The 4.8 pounds of grain fed to cattle to produce one pound of beef for human beings represents a colossal waste of resources in a world still teeming with people who suffer from profound hunger and malnutrition.
A 10-acre farm can support 60 people growing soybeans, 24 people growing wheat, 10 people growing corn and only two producing cattle. Britain—with 56 million people—could support a population of 250 million on an all-vegetable diet. Because 90 percent of U.S. and European meat eaters’ grain consumption is indirect (first being fed to animals), Westerners each consume 2,000 pounds of grain a year.
While it is true that many animals graze on land that would be unsuitable for cultivation, the demand for meat has taken millions of productive acres away from farm inventories. The cost of that is incalculable. As ‘Diet For a Small Planet’ author Frances Moore Lappé writes, imagine sitting down to an eight-ounce steak. “Then imagine the room filled with 45 to 50 people with empty bowls in front of them. For the ‘feed cost’ of your steak, each of their bowls could be filled with a full cup of cooked cereal grains.â€
Harvard nutritionist Jean Mayer estimates that reducing meat production by just 10 percent in the U.S. would free enough grain to feed 60 million people. Authors Paul and Anne Ehrlich note that a pound of wheat can be grown with 60 pounds of water, whereas a pound of meat requires 2,500 to 6,000 pounds.
Environmental Costs
Energy-intensive U.S. factory farms generated 1.4 billion tons of animal waste in 1996, which, the Environmental Protection Agency reports, pollutes American waterways more than all other industrial sources combined. Meat production has also been linked to severe erosion of billions of acres of once-productive farmland and to the destruction of rainforests.
And that is only part of what meateaters are doing to destroy our planet. Do a bit of research before making mundane comments on a subject you know nothing about.
And congrats to Leona- she looks fabulous, but then vegetarians generally do have a much healthier glow about them than meateaters.
@ Pastafarian
‘I was a vegetarian for two years. And knowing now the kind of people that inhabit that world I would never go back because I wouldn’t want to support this kind of lunacy.’
Hmmm this is odd. Being a vegetarian means you make food choices that don’t involve slaughtered animals- what the hell does it have to do with the people you mix with?
I have been vegetarian for 25 years, vegan for 14, and I have never had to mix with people i don’t get on with due to what I decide to put on my plate each night. Not even once.
I am confused.
Don’t be confused.
Prada or knockoff, leather or pleather.
It’s irrelevant.
Leona wants to give the appearance of wearing leather. She wants her fans to believe that leather is sexy and cool.
To hell with all u meat-loving crazy bastards. I SAW a bag just like that in HMV stores in the UK and guess what????/……….it was FAUX LEATHER. To all you people who go on about how meat-eating is right…..stop attacking vegetarians……we have NOT done anything to you. And for f***’s sake, stop going on about God making animals tasty……he doesn’t probably even exist!! PASTAFARIAN, u are just jealous of Leona. Get a life.
DOG FACE
This is not an attack on vegetarians, just vegetarian hypocrites.
You’re damn right I’m jealous of her! She gets to go to those ceremonies carrying that cute bag, in those sexy heels and no one says anything to her. I show up dressed like that outside the high school girl’s locker room and the police show up. Why does everybody think thats weird? Anybody know how to get around a restraining order?
LMAO pasta! i was going to say something but now i totally forgot. nevermind hahaha
There is such a thing as plastic you know that actually looks very much like leather. Don’t knock her because she is better than the rest of you. Give the girl a break. She is just coming into the fame world and wants to make a point about being vegeterian. There is nothing wrong with being a vegeterian and although im not one my self that is the choice i make and being a vegetarian is the choice she makes.
They voted her number 1 sexiest vegetaian and there is nothing anyone else can do about it. The girl is real sexy andshows how a healthy woman should look. She has the perfect figure, voice and face and is going to go far with her singing. Shame you haters just can’t admit it!
I don’t get why she could be considered sexy in the first place. She makes me want to throw up, and her song “Bleeding Love” sucks. She is, as someone here previously stated, a Maraih Carey rip-off, and a bad one too.
@DOG FACE
Seriously, learn to type. It makes you sound like a ignorant little 13 year old when yoy tIpE lYke DiS, and I hate having to decode what you’re trying to say.
Seems to me not eating meat affects your hand/eye coordination as Animal Lover and DOG FACE can’t seem to type correctly. I have a hard time taking either of you seriously.
She’s better than any of us, bex? Sorry, but no one person is necessarily better than the next unless you are comparing them to blatantly evil people. Being a vegetarian doesn’t make someone a better person, and as far as this one is concerned, there are a million prettier women out there, and she’s hardly the second coming of the Beatles.
debbie,
Beside the fact that you totally missed my point (not sure who you were responding to but you seemed to be hitting against the point I was trying to make). I was just saying that one is no better than the other. Vegans act as if by not eating meat they are above those who do, you seem to feel that way as you say that “meateaters” are distroying that planet. Guess what, it’s not just us horrible “meateaters” that are ruining the planet. It’s people. You are just as at fault as all the people you slam. Use gas in your car? Ever buy something that is in a plastic package? Purchase any pleather? Use hydro electricity? Cook on a bbq? Fly in a plane? Yeah all that s*** is killing the environment too. I could really go on and on. As you and DOG FACE seem to forget is that being a vegan doesn’t get you a get out of jail free card when it comes to damage to the environment. You are no better than anyone else. That was the point I was trying to make. Using pleather instead of leather, thinking you are helping out the environment, is stupid. I have been on both sides of this and I find to fight for either side is pointless. Telling people they are bad because they eat meat is just hateful. If you want to control someone’s life, have children, but don’t hate others for choosing to eat meat. Why don’t you just hate someone for being Catholic or Jewish while you’re at it?
Cindy
“faux leather/fur isn’t really harmful to the environment, but i won’t go into an al gore thing here. just saying…”
Do you know what this stuff is make of? Plastic. How can you say that plastic is any better than leather for how it affects the planet. They are equally harmful on the environment and its eco systems.
Well said, SweetCandy.
The fanatical vege-philes will convince themselves that they are doing so much for the environment by not eating meat, look down their noses at other people because they think that they are somehow morally superior because they never actually look at the big picture. We are all consumers. SweetCandy already outlined some excellent examples that I am not going to rehash, but let’s think about this for a moment:
The vege-philes strive to live this animal product free life, but it’s an impossibility. I think it was brought up on another thread, but I will repeat it here. All those products that boast they weren’t tested on animals? That’s bull. The ingredients that have gone into those products had to be in order to be approved by the FDA. Somewhere along the line, animals are killed or displaced when any vegetable field is ploughed. All those products get shipped somewhere, and they aren’t running on unicorn magic and fairy dust across a rainbow highway. No one is truly a vegan if they are insulin dependent.
There’s nothing wrong with choosing not to eat meat, but again, not doing so doesn’t make you a better person. So, really, what right do you have to pass judgement?
Deceiver, maybe YOU should think better than this. It says vegetarian, not VEGAN.
And?
No way thats not a woman…its a transvestite!
Someone got it all wrong it should be sexiest transvestite not vegetarian.
Im happy to have sort it out for you ppl!
Regina, it doesn’t matter. PETA’s official stance is that meat AND fur is murder. Being “just a vegetarian” doesn’t cut it for its most vocal followers. Therefore, there’s an inconsistency for praising someone who does one but doesn’t do the other.
If PETA saw Leona whatsherface waltzing around some huge city and she wasn’t famous or anything, they’d be throwing red paint on her jacket, because she wore fur, but since she is famous or fairly well known and has professed her “dedicated” vegetarianism, that’s good enough for the Pedantic Elite Tools Association known as PETA.
As if PETA couldn’t be any worse: Hypocritical, intolerant, misogynistic, shallow, and self-righteous, idealistic, naive, arrogant, and fundamentally retarded, biased should be added to that list.
It’s clear to me all you have to say to be on PETA’s good side is to tell everyone you’re a vegetarian, and anything you say is upheld by them.
yes,the world is getting bad.
SweetCandy,
You’re missing the point too. You’re basically saying that not eating meat doesn’t make a difference just because the veg(etari)an in question might still drive a car. That’s like saying “don’t even bother putting CFL lightbulbs in your lamps if you’re still going to board a plane once every two years.” That’s an awfully myopic viewpoint. Every little bit helps, always. Bringing your own bag to the supermarket helps, one bag at a time. CFLs help. Taking the bus once a week helps. And not eating meat is one of the single biggest things one can do to minimize one’s impact on the environment.
Yeah, we’re all consumers, but it really is not an us-versus-them thing, so stop trying to make it one. It’s not about one person being better than another. It’s about each person trying to do what s/he can. If you don’t think the environment is worth caring for, just come out and say so. But don’t slam people who are trying to make a difference just because they are not perfect.
Same for the ingredients issue Chronic Malanga cites… It’s not a perfect world out there, and vegans can’t make it so. But do you really believe that it’s better to do nothing only because you can’t do everything? Just so you don’t have to be attacked for being a hypocrite? I’ll continue to do what I can while you sit there and moan about how things aren’t perfect, thank you very much. Enjoy.
I’m not out to change the world. I’m just trying to live in it, first of all. If that’s bad, so be it. I can sleep well at night knowing that my giving up a vegetarian diet has made me a much healthier person, and my health is my first priority.
I believe that most people, myself included, do a lot to help the environment. No, none of us are perfect, and we do not expect to be. However, when some hypocritical group like PETA, and they are hypocritical, goes out of their way to try and force everyone to be herbivores, which is not natural for people, and they endorse terrorist tactics and terrorist groups like ALF, hire and praise arsonists and convicted criminals willing to blow up laboratories, then I have a real problem with them. With all that self righteousness, you would think they would at least try to hide the hypocrisy a little more by not allowing people who wear leather (Pam, Leona), go sport fishing and get caught in public eating meat (Jenna) to represent them.
I check where my donations go so that PETA never gets a hold of my money. I do not support anything that PETA endorses. Quite frankly, it’s one of my many personal missions in life to speak out against these puppy killing beasts that would deny someone a chance at beating a disease just so a lab rat doesn’t die. That doesn’t mean I do not support animal welfare or believe in torturing food animals. I worked with animals for five years, including livestock. These slaughterhouse stories are not representative of the majority. PETA would like people to think so, but it’s simply a lie to push a radical agenda coming from very unhinged and protein deprived individuals who feel guilty for being human.
Chronic Malanga,
Again you are making this about PETA rather than dealing with the points I was making in response to posts you and SweetCandy made earlier, which had nothing to do with PETA whatsoever. So I’ll let you get back to your stated mission in life — I obviously made a mistake thinking we could discuss anything else.
Goodnight.
So you really believe that you can stop eating meat to save the world? See, you are obviously brainwashed by people like PETA if you think that. Furthermore, I have addressed the fact that I, and many other meat eaters, are doing just as much for the environment. The difference is that I have limits and am comfortable with them, and don’t need to be cowed into treating my body badly because of some misguided belief that we can stop global warming (WE’RE ALL GOING TO DIE, LET’s PANIC!!!) by not eating meat. I also don’t need to announce to all creation that I am doing this that or the other to help the environment, as these people do.
The reason that they are hypocrites is that these people are trading in one environmentally bad thing for another and acting as though they are saints because of it. Leather production is more environmentally sound than pleather production, by the way. And leather feels better and lasts longer. They also take this hard line that they themselves do not follow to a tee as they try to browbeat others into doing.
So, if my response wasn’t clear enough, which I feel that it was, because it is about PETA in the end no matter how you want to view it, here ya go.
I believe that not eating meat helps the environment, yes. I thought that was clear enough too. That is all I said, and because you cannot argue with that (facts will do that to a person), you keep bringing up PETA. So I am done with this exchange, since it clearly is leading nowhere productive. Have a nice day.
LOL! But that cannot be brought up without PETA. It’s one of the main reasons they give. And it’s not entirely accurate.
Furthermore, what would you rather do? Save the environment or eat a healthy diet? You haven’t addressed that, now have you? I prefer my own health to saving the environment any day of the week. Yeah, I’m selfish. I don’t care.
Oh, An, aside from the fact that I am not going to martyr myself for the environment by compromising my health, which is argument enough for me as humans are omnivores and healthiest when they have a balanced diet, here are a few facts for you.
Buying local meat destroys half your argument. If my meat is coming from a few miles down the road or my own backyard, then not only am I not contributing to the supposed deforestation, but you should know that the deforestation argument falls flat when that land is not being used to rear animals. Furthermore, the land people use to raise cattle and other food animals is no good for farming anyway.
Methane is a tired excuse. The methane produced by cow’s bottoms is only a small percentage of the methane produced on a farm, or out in nature for that matter.
A completely vegetarian/vegan diet is not the answer. It’s not anywhere near as healthy as a balanced omnivorous diet. Do what you want, but I am not going to be guilted into iron and vitamin deficiency, nor am I going to pop a pill to make up for the meat I am not eating.
But of course, as you have not bothered to address the main reason for eating meat (we are humans and should), you will not address the real facts behind saving the environment. Truthfully, An, I can’t imagine sacrificing one’s diet and health on such shaky grounds. And even if the argument weren’t shaky and actually had some substance to it, tough. I like cow. I like lamb. I like pork. Not only that, it’s essential to my well being, and that is my number one concern.
Chronic Malanga,
I don’t really know why I am back here, but after your latest musings I feel I need to clarify why I said a discussion between us cannot be constructive. Here’s why:
Exhibit A) I say “I believe not eating meat helps the environment,” you say “So you think you can save the world” or “stop global warming?”
Exhibit B) I say “Don’t do nothing because you can’t do everything,” you say “I’m not going to martyr myself [...] by compromising my health.”
You see how you turn everything into a black or white proposal? My whole point was moderation, doing what you can, but you keep wanting to tell me that I’m out to save the world (and failing miserably). I never claimed to be perfect, in fact, I said there’s no way I can be, but I try to do what I can. I also never said you were not trying, but you keep acting as if I did. The only statement you made that I challenged was about the ingredients in products that were not tested on animals. But most of the things you shot back at me were based on assumptions you made about me (or vegans in general). For example:
Exhibit C) I never expressed support for PETA, yet you act as if I did, and better yet, you say one cannot talk about caring for the environment without also talking about PETA. Why? Because that happens to be near the top of their agenda as well. What?! So everyone who cares about the environment automatically supports PETA? That doesn’t even half make sense. The reason we (or I should say you) keep talking about PETA is because it’s your mission in life — you’ve said as much.
Now, about the things you want me to address, I will do so because you asked so nicely. I was B-12 deficient and dependent on injections long before I became a vegan. I never particularly cared for the taste of meat either, so you see, there is no sacrifice or martyrdom here. That’s all in your head, along with the alleged “holier-than-thou” attitude. You may have gotten that attitude from other vegans, but you certainly did not get it from me.Â
You ask “What would you rather do? Save the environment or eat a healthy diet?” I believe that I can contribute to caring for the environment (please don’t turn it into “saving the universe”) and eat a healthy diet at the same time. It’s not an either/or situation. You may think in those kinds of terms, but that’s not reality. While my stomach can’t absorb the only essential nutrient meat has to offer, I can get all the protein, vitamins, minerals and essential amino acids I need from other food. You feel healthy eating meat and you like it, so you good for you. I feel good without it. The only question I have for you is, if you are as comfortable with your limits as you say you are, how come you feel a need to defend or justify them so fiercely?Â
Regarding farmland, yes, some land that is used for farming is not suitable for growing plants, this is true. Some of it, not all of it. But that still doesn’t change the fact that we have to grow a massive amount of corn and grain to feed all these animals we eat. It’s a hugely ineffiecient way of producing food, and it does tax the environment much more than raising grain mainly for human consumption would. Does buying local meat help? Absolutely, but if everyone wanted to do that (and keep eating as much meat as they are today), there wouldn’t be enough local meat to go around. That’s how we got here in the first place: the rising appetite for meat. Back in the day, it was all local and we didn’t have factory farms. But the current demand cannot be sustained by local farmers alone. If you raise meat in your backyard and eat only that, I applaud you.
You say the main reason for eating meat is because we’re humans and we should. Yeah, we’re omnivores and we have a few sad little canines left in our mouths, I get it. But look at all we have to do to meat to make it palatable and digestible, compared to what a true carnivore is capable of taking on. And what about someone like me who is unable to digest meat properly? Am I less human? I doubt it. My point is: just because we’ve always done something doesn’t mean we have to keep doing it. We have options now. Plus, I’m not even advocating that everyone stop eating meat altogether. But if we collectively reduced our meat intake and treated it as a luxury rather than a daily staple, it would make a huge impact on our environmental efforts. If you want to call that brainwashing, you go ahead, I call it common sense.
The bottom line for me is, and I’m sure you’ll find this further proof of that insufferable superiority complex you ascribe to vegans: I don’t feel a need to make excuses for what I eat. And I like that. I know that there is no such thing as perfection, but by definition, veganism does not strive for that. Here it is: “Veganism is a philosophy and way of living which seeks to exclude — as far as is possible and practical — all forms of exploitation of and cruelty to animals for food, clothing, or any other purpose.”
“As far as is possible and practical” is what’s key here. So the next time you feel a need to slam a vegan for using a shampoo that was not tested on animals but may contain ingredients that were, please consider that phrase. I am comfortable with my choices and with my efforts to reduce my impact on the world I live in, and if you feel the same about your choices and efforts, then I really don’t see what there is to argue about.
I asked nicely because I am a nice person, An, not because I felt the need to grovel.
Now, you are in the minority on several counts:
a. You don’t eat meat because of a health issue.
b. You were B12 deficient before you stopped eating meat.
c. Your last post did not have a holier than thou tone attached to it because you are vegan.
All over America and Europe, farmers are being paid to not grow wheat/corn, etc. This is nothing new, nothing you hear about beyond Farm Aid concerts, and nothing that most advocates for a vegan diet will acknowledge. There is actually more than enough to feed a lot of the people in the world that are starving, but it’s not getting done. The whys and hows are not important to the point I am making, but the point is, all that grain being grown for livestock is not a waste. It is feeding animals that are a vital part of our diet. And they are a vital part of our diet. I am against most battery farming. I only buy free range, so yeah, good point there, but let me ask you this as we move into the deforestation panic attacks people have over this. If you are in America or the UK, when is the last time you walked into Publix or Tesco and bought beef from South America? I buy British meat, Welsh lamb, and my eggs come from the three chickens at my sister in law’s house. If I had more room I would go back to the way things were when I was growing up and raise my own food for slaughter because it tastes better. Simple reason, but the only reason I am concerned with.
The world is not cutting down on meat intake. It’s not going to. It doesn’t want to. I don’t have an issue with it being more expensive because it is raised properly (check out Hugh Fearnley Whittinstall’s Chicken-Out campaign). What I have problems with are the following, which will explain my rabid defense of eating meat:
a. Eating meat, unless you have a specific health issue with it, is better for you than not eating animal products. PETA and other rabid vegans cherry pick information and misinform people through terror campaigns, and that is unethical, perverse, and in many cases, should be criminal.
b. Vegan babies fail to thrive like meat eating counterparts. Proven fact. Even their mother’s breast milk is inferior if she is a vegan.
c. Vegans, especially children, are more prone to rickets, vitamin deficiencies, anemia, slow growth rates, eye problems, and raising a child vegan is child abuse. You won’t convince me otherwise.
d. I resent the hell out of anyone that thinks not eating meat makes them better than someone who does. I can guarantee that I have more respect for the animal I eat than they do for any living animal.
e. I slam the hypocrites, because they are, due to reason d. I will not have some dead eyed hippie freak tell me that I am a murderer when they are not making their own shampoos from natural ingredients at home to avoid things that are animal tested. If you are going to look down your nose at someone, you need to be spotless yourself.
If I am going to eat an animal, I have no problem wearing it. Fur isn’t my thing, but I like my shoes to be real leather. I like my bag to be real leather. It is environmentally sound compared to pleather, and if it weren’t, I wouldn’t care because pleather feels like crap on the skin.
Chronic Malanga,
I stopped eating meat because I realized one day that I was choosing to keep some animals as companions, yet eat others, and that I couldn’t really explain (nor was I comfortable with) why I made that distinction between the two. I know I could never catch & kill a pig or chicken any more than I could eat my cat, and raw meat and eggs thoroughly gross me out. So that’s a big part of the reason why I stopped eating meat. The B-12 deficiency only made the decision easier, because I was already in a position where supplements were a necessity, not a choice. For clarity’s sake: I have no “health issue” with eating meat, my stomach just cannot absorb B-12, so there is really no point for me to eat it.
I could have left it at that but I stopped eating dairy as well because like you, I have a problem with battery farming. A big problem. I want nothing to do with it. Your solution is to find animal products that do meet your standard, mine is to avoid them as much as is possible and practical. Where I live, the latter is easier to do than the former.
You’re absolutely right when you say the world doesn’t want to reduce its meat intake. It also does not want to reduce its dependence on fossil fuels. And it’s not going to, until it becomes necessary (not in our lifetime), or someone figures out a way to make more money with alternatives, whichever comes first. But there is a green movement that is growing stronger and wider, and I personally am happy to see that.
I also understand and agree that there are many political, economic and other reasons why the world’s food supply is not reaching the hungry, but that doesn’t take anything away from the fact that yes, it IS wasteful to feed that much grain to animals. We just don’t need to eat that much meat. If we ate only that which was “vital,” or even a little more just because we like it, there would be no need to mass-produce it, and all the abuse that comes with it.
Deforestation, all I can say about that is that it comes back to common sense for me: as the world population grows and its desire for meat grows with it, we’ll need to produce ever more grain to raise that meat, and we’ll need to get the space to do it from somewhere, yeah? Is it reason to panic? Not yet, but in cases like these where I just can’t be sure how bad it is or is going to be, I tend to err on the side of caution and do my best to conserve. It’s not like it costs me anything to do that. On the contrary.
Regarding a, b and c, please tell me where you found this proof. I’m serious. I’ve done my homework on this too, and to the best of my knowledge, there are no scientifically/statistically significant studies available that have looked into the long-term effects of eating an all-vegan diet. There are some, but their scope is rather small and they are not conclusive or representative for the population at large. If you have access to better information than I’ve been able to find, please share.
I can agree with you on d and e if, but only IF, you are getting that kind of an attitude from someone. However, I have to say that I feel you have a bit of a chip on your shoulder about this issue and are quick to make assumptions. Please don’t paint all vegans with the same brush and try to give people the benefit of the doubt until they prove you wrong.
Leather/pleather, again, it doesn’t have to be an either/or thing. I’ve got several bags and shoes that are neither. Leather shoes may feel better on my bare feet but I don’t want to sit on a leather couch on a hot day. I personally like bags made out of fabric, and shoes with wooden soles. Yeah, I lived in Holland for a while.
Have a nice weekend!
Hey An… First, I hope you will accept my apology for coming off like a harpy in previous posts. I have received the attitudes in d and e from several people in the RL, as well as from one poster on this site that attacked not only me, but several others in the Jessica Simpson post. That person was the straw that broke the camel’s back for me, but it was a long time coming. See, I’ve done a lot of research on the whole vegetarian thing, and in between plenty of information that highlights pros and cons in an unbiased manner, you will always find the radicals that truly have no regard for human life or health. You did not deserve that, and I am not generally like that. Again, that person set me off and I was automatically defensive.
I’m not going to argue the environmental issue because we will have to agree to disagree. I find that human health is more important, and that we have to protect our meat resources as much as we do any other by using them responsibly. I do not feel it a waste to raise grain for livestock when we have more than enough grain to do so, and when the Amazon rain forests are being used for vegetable crops that feed people as well.
I would like to direct you to a study by Lindsay Allen, of the US Agricultural Research Service. While part of her study was funded by some cattle association and it even made me suspicious at the outset, the results over a two year period were clear. Using 544 African school children, she saw that a certain portion were fed 2 tablespoons of meat per day, while others were on a vegan diet, and yet others were kept on the same diet they had always been on, which was a poor one, but just enough to live on. I know it’s lame that I do not have the bookmark at the ready, but this isn’t something I keep in my favorites to be honest. The study confirmed what the majority of doctors have said all along. Meat is vital for a healthy diet. Those that did not eat animal products did not concentrate in school as well, were smaller, and had a host of vitamin deficiencies. From personal experience, I can tell you that my doctors (I moved from FL to TX during the time I was a vegetarian) urged me to start eating meat despite my otherwise healthy diet (I’m not a junk food person), as much as they urge me to quit smoking. The reasons were all the same. In the news recently, we have two examples of how horrible a vegan diet is for a child. I won’t get overly redundant, but that girl in Scotland was just one example of the rising number of vegan children who develop rickets due to a bad diet. Nursing mothers who do not eat animal products have been shown to produce inferior milk. It goes on. Again, it’s lame to not provide some links, but I am sure that they are easy enough to dig up if you are interested. Many adults that are strict vegans, this according to my doctors and the People Eating Tasty Animals web site, will develop eye problems.
When I became a vegetarian, it was a knee jerk reaction to my grandfather’s death from diabetes. I suffered for that decision, especially because there was nothing wrong with my diet to begin with. I went from being strong as an ox healthy to weak bones (I slipped a disk in my neck during this period), and having some sort of cold or flu at least once a month. I never felt well. I also gained weight like crazy. I wasn’t eating junk food, but I might as well have been. I’ve always been thin, and during that time, I put on twenty pounds. When I introduced meat back into my diet, I lost it fast, recovered more quickly from my injury, and ceased to get sick on a monthly basis. It’s been two years now, and I think the closest I’ve been to a cold was after climbing Snowdon on a spring day with the weather changing every five minutes from hot to cold and back again.
I love animals, and I understand your revulsion at eating something you could befriend. However, I come from farming and fishing families, and I was wringing chicken necks and cleaning fish at five years old. I was taught that some animals are there to feed us, and though it was never an excuse to mistreat them, they were not there to be pets. In fact, they deserved our respect all the more because they were dying to nourish the family. I feel strongly that food should be prepared properly and never wasted because of that. My dogs, when I was a child, were guards or helpers in the hunt. I am not on a farm now, and I am not as extreme as my grandparents were in the idea that if you can’t eat it don’t feed it, but I recognize the difference between a companion and a potential meal and treat them as such. This is why I don’t mind leather, or other animal products.
I would have a leather couch if I didn’t have a Rhodesian Ridgeback and a Beagle that would leave talon marks in it. It doesn’t get hot where I live.
Anyhow, I’ve rambled and I am ready for bed. Have a good weekend.
Hi Chronic Malanga,
Of course I will gladly accept your apolology, though I don’t think anything was said here that was so egregious that one was due…
I will look into that study you mentioned. I personally believe that each individual has a unique makeup and that a diet or lifestyle that works well for one may not work for the other. I think this becomes most apparent when you see people who live a “healthy” lifestyle die from liver cancer at age 47, when others who smoke and drink and eat junk every day can live to be 92. Both my parents have heart disease, and my brother had a heart attack at 47, so keeping my cholesterol and blood pressure low is very important to me. A plant-based and low-sodium diet works well for me in that regard.
We can agree to disagree about the environment. I was going to propose that in my last post but I didn’t want to drag that old cliché out and have you wag your finger at me for not addressing the issue.
The only thing I’d still like to share with you about that — not trying to convince you, just giving you my point of view — is that I don’t see human health and caring for the environment as competing interests. Once again, I think we can do both, and I think a healthy living environment is essential for humankind to thrive. The way I see it, it’s in our own interest to care for our surroundings and use our resources responsibly, as you said.
I’m glad we were able to work past our differences and calm down the rhetoric. Thank you for that. If I could send you a cookie, I would.
Apolology? Jeez. Maybe my eyes are already going.
I will aplologize as well if that works, and send back some sort of soy cookie.
I see what you mean on each personal make up being different. The women in my family all smoke, myself included. I am not a heavy smoker(less than a pack a day unless I am drinking and that’s not an everyday thing), especially compared to my 86 year old grandmother who has outlived most of her doctors and doesn’t have a thing wrong with her. She’s hardcore. Unfiltered. Chain smoker. But that’s how it’s worked for all the women. The men, not so lucky. As healthy as they have been, diabetes or prostate cancer has hit them all, and only one male relative in my memory has lived to see 80. I myself am pre-diabetic and paranoid enough to at least eat right and exercise because I am a female version of my diabetic gramps not only in personality but in blood sugar patterns, as I am discovering now that I am in my thirties. I would argue that having meat in one’s diet is best for the majority, though. That study should not be the only thing one looks at. Conversations with health professionals, as well as reading material one of my doctors was fond of running off for me all point to the same result. Obviously, your B12 issues and family history are good argument for avoiding or at least cutting down on meat.
Not to drive the environment thing into the ground given we’ve agreed to disagree, but just another point to make. I don’t believe vegan diets are ever going to impact the environment. Even buying free range, local foods aren’t going to make a huge impact because too many people can’t spend the money on the more expensive option, just as too many people would rather jump off a cliff than give up meat. I don’t think that going vegan is necessarily competition at its very core, to be honest. My only problem with the argument is that when the radical groups push it, they act as though the entire planet depends on it and nothing else, and that’s just inaccurate. I think we both know that. In their arguments, they are making it a competing interest and riding it into the ground in the most alarmist way possible, effectively stating that the poor kid in Africa should starve rather than eat meat that Charity X ships into his village. And that’s where my outrage at the whole thing comes in. I don’t trust a group that on one hand tells me that it’s healthier for me to be a vegan when their tactics are based on the central idea that humans are not worthwhile animals. After all, PETA would rather see children die of cancer than sacrifice rats to test for the drugs that might save them, so if we are so worthless as a species, it would follow that they don’t have humanity’s best interest in mind when they go off about raising kids vegan and saving the environment. I get a little hot under the collar about it when these groups target people on an emotional level and they make this the entire reason for going vegan. It’s the whole “ethical” aspect of it that makes me roll my eyes and wonder why people don’t dig deeper.
Not off topic, but sort of, I believe that people would have a greater appreciation for the meat on their plate if they knew where it came from. In the modern age, we get our meat cleaned and wrapped neatly in cellophane. It’s all very clean and clinical. A lot of kids think a hamburger is…ham. Hugh Fearnely Whittingstall and Jamie Oliver, along with Gordon Ramsay did a week’s worth of programming on this concept with the Chicken Out campaign here in the UK. Results have been mixed and are ongoing, but Tesco reported that the free range chickens were outselling battery chickens the week after. I don’t know if you’ve checked it out or not, but it was graphic without being preachy, and the social experiment involved was fascinating, though again, it achieved some interesting results. Hugh is still at it, though, and fast becoming both loved and hated throughout the UK. I would get into it here but I’m nearly writing a novel at this point.
Anyhow, I am happy we could have a calm debate about all this, and have to thank you as well.:)
Hey CM,
Let’s enjoy those cookies and our truce while they last, because I did look into that study you cited and I’m afraid I’m gonna have to raise the BS flag on that particular one — regardless of who paid for it or what Ms. Allen’s affiliation is. This is what the BBC has to say about how the study was conducted, please correct if you see inaccuracies:
“The 544 children studied had been raised on diets chiefly consisting of starchy, low-nutrition corn and bean staples lacking these micronutrients. This meant they were already malnourished.
Over two years, some of the children were given 2oz supplements of meat each day, equivalent to about two spoonfuls of mince. Two other groups received either a cup of milk a day or an oil supplement containing the same amount of energy. The diet of a fourth group was left unaltered.
The changes seen in the children given the meat, and to a lesser extent the milk or oil, were dramatic. These children grew more and performed better on problem-solving and intelligence tests than any of the other children at the end of the two years.
Adding either meat or milk to the diets also almost completely eliminated the very high rates of vitamin B12 deficiency previously seen in the children.”
Alright. So, my issue with this study, if this is how it was in fact done, is quite simple. What we have here is 4 groups of children who were eating nothing but corn and beans up until the start of the experiment. During the study, they ate like this:
Group 1: Corn, beans and 2oz of meat
Group 2: Corn, beans and a cup of milk
Group 3: Corn, beans and a cup of oil
Group 4: Nothing but corn and beans
I’m sorry, but “corn and beans and nothing else” does not constitute a “vegan diet.” What she should have included was a fifth group that eats something somewhat in the vicinity of a balanced vegan diet — including tofu, soy milk, fruit, grains and vegetables — and see how they did. Of course children who eat nothing but corn and beans will improve when you add meat or milk to their diet… I would assume they’d improve from adding just about anything to their diets. Even if it’s only oil, apparently.
You won’t hear me deny that meat is an easy way to get a lot of what we need (assuming one can process it correctly), and that getting the equivalent nutrients from a vegan diet is more work, although it’s not nearly as difficult as most people think. I’ll also concede the B-12 issue for the sake of the discussion (it’s more complicated and not entirely true that it can only be had from animal products, but you already know that). But feeding someone only corn and beans and calling it a vegan diet just doesn’t cut it. Sorry. That’s like that situation with the baby who died because s/he was fed nothing but soy milk and apple juice… and people say, see, eating vegan is bad. No, starving your child and feeding it only soy milk and apple juice is bad. And the ignorant vegans who did that to their child are murderers.
Look, I don’t know enough about baby food and breast milk because I don’t have children. But I can tell you that if I ever did I would make sure I fed him/her what s/he needed, even if it included animal products. Simple as that. I may even play it safe and do that anyway — why take the risk, this is your CHILD, right? I feed my 2 cats meat too. They’re carnivores, they need it. It does not make sense to jeopardize the health of one animal to “save” another, and it’s criminal to jeopardize the health of a human child to adhere to vegan principles. We can agree on that, I think.
And we can agree that PETA takes its agenda much, much too far, and that their tactics leave a lot to be desired (to put it mildly), though some of their positions are actually more nuanced than what is echoed on sites like these (no offense, everyone, please, no egg-throwing). It gets pretty emotional on both sides of this argument, and the same sort of alarmist attitude permeates the anti-vegan crowd. “If you eat vegan you will be protein-deprived and you will DIE and your children will all be RETARDED!!!”
You know what I mean? It’s so counterproductive. I can’t tell you how many people were suddenly so very concerned about my protein intake when I became vegan, though they never batted an eye when my diet consisted of a mixture of ramen noodles, fast food and lean cuisines.
I do wholeheartedly agree with your “sort of off-topic” statement. I have much more respect for people like you who have actually done their share of chicken neck-wringing and fish-cleaning and would be prepared to do it again, than I do for people who have never been closer to a cow than when they pick up the cellophane-wrapped package from the supermarket, and cover their ears to avoid finding out what gelatin is really made of.
Okay. I hope I haven’t just trashed our carefully brokered peace. I’ve enjoyed our back-and-forth, although it had very little to do with Leona’s bag. And I’d be happy to continue the novel-writing, but we may just be too far apart on this one. I don’t know. I’ll leave that up to you. I’m going to check out that chicken thing now. I only glanced at it briefly the other day.
Chicken Out seems like a good initiative to me. Too bad he didn’t get the votes, but I still wish we had something like it here in the US, if only to raise awareness. Sadly, the term “free-range” is only minimally regulated here, and only applies to meat, not eggs. The USDA only requires producers of free-range or free-roaming meat to prove that the poultry has been allowed access to the outside (see link below for their fact sheet). That’s it. One door in a hangar with 20,000 birds to a 10×10 feet fenced in dirt patch would be sufficient, by this definition.
For eggs, the term “free-range” or is not regulated at all, though one might assume that a free-range egg must come from a free-range chicken, the USDA has not specifically said so. Tons of people buy free-range eggs thinking they’re getting a superior product that comes from chickens who are out running around in the grass (since that tends to be the picture on the cartons), and it’s just not true in many cases. I think that’s wrong, because those people are getting ripped off. They pay more for something that isn’t better, or they pay more thinking they’re ensuring a better life for those chickens, and they’re not.
http://www.fsis.usda.gov/FactSheets/Meat_&_Poultry_Labeling_Terms/index.asp
LOL Chronic, you’re making me do all sorts of research and now I’ve come across a phrase I wish I never read: “vegetarians have faster gut transit times.” Eeeew.
This comes from a Independent article I have not finished reading yet:
http://www.independent.co.uk/life-style/health-and-wellbeing/health-news/what-not-to-eat-442073.html
Faster gut transit times… whoa. Very interesting way to phrase “poop more quickly”.
Good article.