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Simon Scowl – I have no persecution complex

Of course not. My mistake.

I dare say that PETA-bashing is probably the single biggest draw this site has, I know it’s what caught my attention and brought me here originally. Regardless of whether or not you or your vegan friends want to admit it, you’re a vanishingly small, if incredibly vocal, minority. We find the idea that an animal’s life is equal to that of a human’s to be a deeply offensive and misguided one. You said you ‘disagree with their tactics’, just like a lot of the vegans that come here – what you fail to realize is that we not only hate their tactics, we hate their message. Even if that woman is wearing fake fur, the entire ‘vegan’ message is hypocritical from the start, which is why they are so often featured on this site.

Vegan: “Humans and animals are equals! No animal should be a slave!”

Average Joe: “So humans are just animals, and shouldn’t be equated any kind of special status that places us above our animal brethren?”

Vegan: “Exactly!”

Average Joe: “So humans are animals. Animals eat animals every day. If we’re no different, why are we being held to a higher standard?”

Vegan: “Because we’re evolved enough to understand compassion! We’ve built complex societies that can now survive without using animal products! We can grasp that our decisions have consequences!”

Average Joe: “Yeah, we are kinda the shit. So animals can’t understand any of those things, eh? That’s why they get to eat each other?”

Vegan: “Now you’ve got it!”

Average Joe: “So, we are better than them, thus negating your entire argument?”

Vegan: “Wait…”

Also, I’ve seen a lot of the same names posting comments in different areas of the site. It seems like pretty typical behavior to me, when someone finds a new site, to read different parts & comment accordingly. As I said before, if there is a window during which you’d like to restrict comments, perhaps you should do that, rather than giving new visitors to your site incentive to not return.

Simon Scowl – you’ve really got something against me, haven’t you?

Only amusement at your persecution complex. Other than that, you seem okay.

Truly I don’t see you replying to anyone else with the same frequency as you do me.

Nobody else is posting silly comments in so many different threads all at once. Don’t take it personally.

Samantha – Don’t be sorry. If I didn’t want someone to give me an answer, I wouldn’t have asked!

No, I don’t live in a “vegetarian bubble” — though, if those exist, tell me where because I’d consider moving into one! I remember once as a kid, I had 2 pet rabbits, and my dad gave me a fur coat for Xmas. The tag inside said “rabbit fur” and I instantly made the connection to my pets. I don’t know why that’s so foreign for so many people.

I definitely can see your point about the whole knock-off thing. Personally I’d think the average person can easily see & feel fake fur, but maybe not.

If I were organizing a protest personally, I’d probably ask people ahead of time not to wear fake fur, just because the average person would probably be confused by it (as obviously they are). So I can agree with you that its probably not the best idea, and that yes, in a way, its going to perpetuate the “real” fur industry. I’ve known lots of vegs that feel that way about fake fur & fake leather.

On the other hand, I just don’t think it makes the wearer a categorical hypocrite. I think that’s a little strong. Like a lot of what I see against the animal rights movement on this site, its an inconsistency at best.

Simon Scowl, I don’t need to beg you for anything.

Too late.

I’ve not seen one good answer to how wearing fake fur makes one a hypocrite. I say its simply an active demonstration that the same look can be achieved without the use of a dead animal.

I’ll probably be sorry for wading into this discussion… But if you wear fake fur nobody but you knows it’s fake. I’m assuming you live in some sort of vegetarian bubble where the possibility of wearing real fur would never cross anyone’s mind, so that option simply wouldn’t be on the table. But for the other 99.5 percent of humanity, when we see someone wearing a furry garment, it’s really a coin-flip.

Wearing a fake-fur coat has the same exact effect on other people as wearing a “real” fur coat: They both fuel a consumer demand for other fur coats (both real and fake). And for those consumers who aspire to own a “real” fur coat someday, seeing lots of fake-fur coats in circulation feeds their desire more than if those fake-fur coats weren’t there (and instead were replaced by Gore-tex jackets or wool pea-coats or something completely different).

This is basic marketing theory 101. It’s ironic, but one of the smartest things furriers could ever have done is to encourage the proliferation of fake-fur garments. They’re a “down-market” knock-off anyway for people who can’t afford the genuine article, but they fuel demand for it. Like a fake Rolex. You don’t really think the Rolex company minds the fake watches being out there, do you? The people who “matter” can tell what’s real, and the fact that the real thing is coveted enough to replicate and knock off in the first place is evidence that it’s culturally indispensable.

You can say the same thing about high-end perfumes (Lalique, Clive Christian, etc.). Nobody there gets upset when your local pharmacy issues a knock-off fragrance, because the person who can pay $15 for the fake was never going to pay $500 for the real thing. But the fact that the knock-off exists at all is a form of free advertising.

Again though, I’ve not seen one good answer to how wearing fake fur makes one a hypocrite.

I say its simply an active demonstration that the same look can be achieved without the use of a dead animal.

Simon Scowl, I don’t need to beg you for anything. See, as the one pointing the finger, the onus is on YOU to back up your statements. The burden is YOURS, not mine. I have a feeling if you had something intelligent to say back to me, you would have by now.