As mentioned yesterday, there seems to have been a fight among animal-rights groups to secure convicted dog killer Michael Vick as a spokesperson. As perplexing and misguided a campaign as it was, given how high-profile the guy has become, I get that they’re capitalizing on the attention. I just happen to think he makes a piss poor role model.
Anyway, the Humane Society of the United States won out over PETA. And as his first act of duty, Vick posted an apology on the blog GlobalGrind.com:
Sitting in a prison cell didn’t make me feel remorse. It was meeting so many animal lovers, speaking with them and looking them in their eyes. Staring at them. Looking so deep into their eyes that I began to feel their pain. Allowing that pain to enter into my body is when I started to understand how bad it really was. I have been trying hard to connect with people who feel this pain,because for my whole life I was disconnected from the suffering of animals. And you might say, “come on Mike, how could you do those things to those dogs?” And you’re right…I ask myself those questions every day. What kind of person does this? How does a human-being treat dogs or any animal with such pain and cruelty? And the hard part for me is the answer to these questions. Because the answer is ME. And I am trying so hard right now to become a better person, because who I was, I am ashamed of.
Cause see, my whole life has been numb. I was numb to the violence in my community…cause I saw it all the time, ever since I was a child. I mean, how does one grow up in a city that’s nickname is Bad Newz? You can probably guess that from the jump, ya’ know I’ve seen some bad things in my life. And football was the only way that I could escape. As a kid, I even used to go out fishing, and most of the times I wouldn’t catch a darn thing, but just needed to get away from the chaos every once in a while.
Hey Mike — animal rights? You’re doing it wrong.
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I don’t understand the incredibly bad rap Michael Vick is getting for the whole dogfighting thing. Yes it was terrible the way he treated the animals, there is no doubt about that. But what perplexes me, is all the people wishing him bodily harm for what he did to, lets keep this in mind, animals, not humans. Seems ya ain’t much better than the PETA freaks with that kind of perspective.
kyle a person who can maime and kill animals is one step away from becoming a serial killer. Most hardened criminals have no problem killing a kitten let alone a dog. Vick basically showed he didn’t care about anything but himself and the pleasure that the death and pain animals were caused gave him. That says a lot about the character of a person.
He doesn’t feel any remorse. “From where he comes from”… It’s like cockfighting in Puerto Rico….”There are certain things that are indicative to certain parts of the country.” So said Whoppi. So why would he feel remorse? Dog fighting to him, apparently, is as normal as putting on your pants. And I very rarely feel bad about putting my pants on. Anymore. At the library.
Kyle, if you’ve ever seen a dog fight, it’s a pretty horrible thing to witness. Having four Australian Shepherds (3 bitches and 1 dog) I have seen exactly three of them. They were between my oldest bitch (ex-Alpha and the new Alpha) which is the middle aged one. By the time I was able to seperate the two, the old one needed about $1000.00 worth of vet care.
MV, may have done his time, but to plan, participate, cause a fight, and run a kennel for the purpose of engaing in dog fighting and then execute an animal for failure to preform, is plan cruel.
MV did his time, lost mega-dinars, and deserves everything that he has coming to him. I just wish that I had the ability to play in the NFL as a linbacker. That way I could legaly hit the SOB and try to seperate his pinhead from his shoulders.
I seem to remember when this first brewed up, his minders and other Vick supporters said something like it was a “culture” thing and we wouldn’t understand. BS!!!!! I understand that it was a sick, perverted thing to do. I hope that some NFL lineman takes out his knees and cripples him.
NO MERCY!!!!
Actually you’re right Kyle. It’s just animals. Light them on fire. Electrocute them. Kick them. Fight them. Drown them. Starve them. Torture them to death. They’re just animals, not people. Sure a puppy can’t defend itself and can feel every bit of pain inflicted on it, but it’s not human so that makes it okay to torture it to death.
It wasn’t just “terrible the way he treated animals” – it was completely inhuman and one of the warning signs of someone being a sociopath. It’s not just a character flaw or a deficit of empathy to do what he did to those dogs, it’s a desire to *hurt* something.
Somebody hand me a baseball bat and I’ll help Michael Vick’s “pain enter his body.” Just let me get one good shot at his knee. I don’t want to kill the guy, I’ll settle for ending his NFL career. I’d say that’s a pretty good perspective.
Perhaps i dont understand because I don’t have a citified sense of refinement like everyone else here I suppose. I just think people put way too much value on animal life. Yes, what he did was fucked up, incredibly fucked up. But it doesn’t mean he ought to be physicaly harmed as a result of what he did. That puts the goddamn animal’s life on the same level as a humans. Which is a favourite tactic of PETA.
What Vick said:
What any non psychotic person would’a said:
What a creep.
Yes, he served his time, but he’s still a creep.
Kyle, I seem to remember from a science class, the the only animal to except another species into it’s home, is the human animal. All other animals will kill/drive off an invading animal. Reading your post #6, are you proposing that we, as a human animal, digress to lower animal behavior and kill/drive off any animal that invades our domain?
The fact that MV engaged in a dog fighting venture, shows no remorse, regardless of what he said, and he should be taken out of the gene pool of the human race.
Look, I eat mean. I have killed, cleaned and cooked plenty of animals in my lifetime ranging from trout to elk.
I do not have a rarified or ‘citified’ sense of the difference between dogs and people so that’s not the reason you don’t understand. Perhaps you never had a dog growing up and never felt the absolute unquestioning loyalty and love a dog could give.
If there’s any justice in reincarnation Vick will keep coming back as one of his own dogs.
Elle, that would be GREAT karma if MV came back as one his dogs!
Actually Kyle, what you are proposing/stating is EXACTLY what Peta wants.
I eat meat, not “mean” as stated in my previous post.
I have stupid fingers today . . . . .
I eat mean.
Also, I think it’s outrageous because honestly…well, I don’t know if anyone else here has been a pit bull owner, but pretty much “dog fighting” means “pit bull” in most people’s minds, which is sad because those of us who have been kind to our pets know that pit bulls don’t deserve the reputation they have.
…my point being that pit bull owners are probably going to be exceptionally offended.
Here we go; the whole “In my community, there’s violence and it twisted me” excuse just came up.
Someone needs to remember him that “Community” dint organized dogfights, he did. It seems to be a custom for those who repent these days to blame their upbringings or the guy next door. I can’t see here nothing more than a PR operation.
I keep going back and forth. Everytime I read about what Vick and others did to those poor dogs, I feel physically ill, but on the other hand, I want to believe that someone who did such things can change. It is somewhat ironic that the Humane Society didn’t catch the fish reference. What really irritates me is that people are willing to throw Vick to the wolves (hahaha), but other sports figures who have done pretty horrendous things to people seem to escape similar outrage. If we are going to condemn animal abuse (and we should), let’s condemn human abuse too. In that respect, I think that Kyle has a point. I don’t think that violence against Vick is appropriate, but as an animal lover and dog owner, I can certainly understand the impulse.
Well I’d say the difference between true animal lovers and PeTA is that most average animal lovers (like some of the ones that post here) care for both animals AND humans. There’s no PeTA-esque ’save the whales, abort the humans’ type mentality. If we were to discuss human rights it’s not like anyone here would start defending a serial killer. It’s just that the topic on hand happens to be animal cruelty, not human.
AllyKat – That was very well said, and I think if Kyle had phrased it that way, it might have gone over better.
Violence is wrong. I know that’s horribly cliched and all, but those of you who know me know that certainly doesn’t come from some hippie “lets all sing koombya” place, simply from a person who’s seen too damn much of it. Violence against animals and children generally brings out far more righteous anger than violence against a grown human, rightfully so, as they are the most defenseless among us and thus the most in need of our protection.
A lot of us, myself included, would like ten minutes in a room with the guy with a baseball bat. However, we have to remember what makes us different than him – we have convictions. Take away our convictions by acting on those impulses, and we become no better than him. Frankly, I think the best medicine is to smash his pocketbook. If it bothers you that much, encourage people not to buy his team’s merchandise or attend their games until he’s let go. That’s what I’ll be doing (hey, I’m a Colts fan anyways).
There are plenty of other people more deserving of baseball bats. I agree that human abuse needs to be remembered, as well. People believe that animals don’t have a voice, so humans must speak for them…but the thing to do about that is….to actually DO something. I adopted my dog, rest his fluffy soul, not only because he was so sweet, but because he had several strikes against him as far as adoption is concerned. People are more afraid of black dogs, at least on a subconscious level, and they feel that black dogs don’t show enough facial expression. The man who owned him previously had abused him, so he was very defensive around men. Then there was the fact that he was heartworm positive.
The shelter was convinced that eventually, he would have to be put to sleep because no one would adopt him. Thankfully, someone sponsored his heartworm treatment, and I ended up with a great big teddy bear of a buddy who didn’t like men who made his mommy uncomfortable. He’d always stand between us and sorta stare the other man down.
…I had a point, but I just made myself sad. I miss him.
“Here we go; the whole “In my community, there’s violence and it twisted me” excuse just came up.” my thoughts exactly, when you’re a grown man you should know right from wrong. vick is what, 29 years old now? he ran the ring for 6 years. he was a “grown up” then, he should have known it was wrong and you can’t keep it a secret forever. like i’ve said before, he’d still be doing this now if he wasn’t caught. the dog fighting is bad enough, but what he did to the dogs who didn’t want to fight seemed even worse..
ahhh michael vick.. seems like his PR handlers forgot to tell him “DON’T SAY ANYTHING ABOUT FISHING”
Okay, fine.
In some “communities”, it’s perfectly natural to use a certain word to refer to black folks.
So by this logic, someone should walk up to Whoopi and Vick and call them by this six-letter word that starts with “n”. If Vick can be excused from dogfighting because it’s “cultural”, then that word should also be excusable.
Dave wins the thread. You will receive your secret decoder ring and snowmobile transformer in 6 to 8 weeks.
As long as the message isn’t “Be sure to drink your Ovaltine”.
Kyle, the very reason people here loathe, detest, despise and abhor PETA is not because they love animals. It’s because THEY DON’T. They claim to love them, and make no secret of the fact that they hate other humans–but while they’re pulling that scam, they’re killing as many animals as they can get their mitts on. THAT is why we hate PETA around here.
And I want a t-shirt with “I eat mean” on it. Awesome.
Dave, that was a fantastic point (about the “culture” thing). That “It’s a black thing, you wouldn’t understand” is about half past played, already. Wrong is wrong.
Elle: “I eat mean” – methinks your subconscious betrayed you.
In the cornfields of the midwest we’d collect any worms eating the corn, and bring ‘em back to the house and have them race each other. If they didn’t perform well, we’d set them on fire. And when we were done with the races, we’d set ‘em all on fire.
Don’t condemn me – it was our culture – you wouldn’t understand.
But seriously, doesn’t it make sense that if you grow up in a violent neighborhood, you’d tend to be violent ? It could be an excuse (scapegoat), but it can also be the main reason someone is indeed violent. Likewise, how many times have we heard of nice successful people saying if it hadn’t been for the positive role models and guidance growing up, they wouldn’t have turned out so well? Works both ways. Granted, by the time you’re in your 20’s you “should” know what’s right and wrong, but your upbringing will help to point you in one direction or the other.
And BTW, 6 to 8 weeks ?
people who do the kinds of things Vick did just have that ability in their makeup. he’s a skeezy nasty creepazoid like so many others.
Les Paul – does that excuse work for the white supremists?
Oh and by the way I grew up in a VERY violent home, can I now beat the shit out of anything that walks by me? I was also sexually abused as a kid, do I get 2 free tickets?
We can blame culture or anything we like; video games, mama didn’t loves me, saw it on TV, heards it on da ray-t-o, someone did to me, it ain’t my fault…blah, blah, blah
When does Personal Responsibility out weight the excuses?
When we all start insisting that it do so, instead of buying these BS excuses from people who could buy their own countries. And from ourselves, and each other, and everybody else. That’s when “culture”, or “family”, or “the moon was full” will no longer stand as a moral blank check.
And when our President stops making excuses for everyone and actually makes a sound judgement that is in the best interest of our country.
Very well put Beige! Of course, common sense and personal responsibility does not apply in this country anymore.
Only Al Sharpton can pardon those in the court of Public Opinion.
Macdonald triad
From Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia
The Macdonald triad (also known as the triad of sociopathy) is a set of three behavioral characteristics that are associated with sociopathic behavior. The triad was first identified by J.M. Macdonald in “The Threat to Kill”, a 1963 paper in the American Journal of Psychiatry.[1]
The triad links animal cruelty, obsession with fire setting, and persistent bedwetting past the age of five to violent behaviors; particularly homicidal behavior.[2] Although other studies have not found statistically significant links between the triad of violence and violent offenders, many serial killers exhibited these behaviors during childhood. Jeffery Dahmer and Dennis Rader, two well-known serial killers, both engaged in acts of animal cruelty.[citations needed]
The truth is as plain as the nose on your face. All Heil Vick, er ahh oops HAIL! Some of us are more equal than others.
I only ran over those toddlers because two trucks on two separate occasions ran over my car.
To D—
“When does Personal Responsibility out weight the excuses?”
What Beige said. I’m saying when I hear of a person arrested for some violent behavior (armed robbery/assault/murder), and then their background is made known, I’m not surprised if they had a rough upbringing. Constantly being told you’ll never amount to anything, etc. And then again sometimes they grew up in a loving home and nice neighborhood – go figure.
Then there are those who had the tough homes/neighborhoods, and said “I’m not going to live my life like this — I can do better. I don’t care what they say about me, I am somebody (to borrow one of the better phrases from the Rev JJ). Sounds like your story – with a very good ending, so no free tickets for you.
My claim is that the situation in which you grow up “tends” to make you similarly minded — it’s gotta have “some” effect on you — either drive you towards your surroundings, or away if you don’t like them. E.G., let’s take the “good surroundings/bad kids” angle: Preacher’s Kids – some of them do the opposite of what their parents want, for no reason than just to rebel. It’s still their choice, though.
Some kids like smashing their toys, and others take care of them for years. Some guys beat up their girlfriends because their dad always beat mom up. Others say “how could dad do that? I’m not going to be like him.” Why the difference? Who knows.
I’ll rephrase a bit, “by the time you’re in your 20’s you “should” know what’s right and wrong”, and the choice is yours to stay like your surroundings, or go the other way.”
I’m not understanding the white supremist question – I don’t know what their malfunction is.
BTW, that worm story ? Made it up.
This is TOTALLY off topic, but I think that woman that asked that Nazi policy question that gave Barney Frank the chance to give his “what planet do you live on” answer in that town hall meeting is a total fraud. I have no proof, just suspicions. A plant?
She seemed too perfect.
Ya know Pasta I wondered the same thing. She was there to make Bawney Fwank look erudite and clever. Two things he is not.
There have been plants in Obama’s town halls. And now that he has told people to fight back, I am sure there are lots of plants in the town hall meetings. You know, to make it look like the American people want the government invading in on their health care.
MSNBC News Flash;
NFL has suspended Michael Vick again.
He was allegedly arreseted last night trying to enter the Philidelphia Eagle mascot in a cock fight.
Developing ……………………
Huh.
We used to do that to the detasselers.
Didn’t Vick go to a university (no idea which one)?
So he didn’t come straight out the ghetto and into this lifestyle. He was exposed to different people and different culture’s. You don’t make it through a major college without knowing how to act and want is acceptable. His claim that he was just ignorant and that’s how he grew up is pure B.S.
Now if he played for the NBA he might have an argument
Minnow: Ouch ! How Cruel !
As I eventually confessed above in post 34, I made that up. What “is” true about the worms, is while husking fresh corn in our suburban back yard, or the occasional trip to a relative’s farm, sometimes you’d peel the husk back and yuckkk, a worm feasting on the corn. For those not familiar with that sight, it’s kinda messy where the worm is. I’m pretty sure we threw ‘em in the grass and stepped on them. Then you’d have to cut away the part they ate.
Why not just get a new piece of corn?
Sometimes you do – other times you get lucky and they haven’t eaten much. We’re talking really fresh corn. I’m always surprised, though, that by the time you find a worm in there, that they haven’t eaten 1/2 of it. I mean, that cobb’s been near mature stage for at least a couple of weeks.
Oh goodlawduponhigh, Pasta… how’d you miss out on the midwestern scrooginess gene?
I’ve seen folks, standing in front of a full field of corn, cut 70% off of a cob just to save the good parts.
Of course they also eat the orange peel and save bread bags for boot inserts, so mebee the genes are a tad tainted ’round here.
Get the media off this guy – he’s loving the attention and the NFL doesn’t care about animals, they care about revenue.
Sickening that we can’t get this guy back in the slammer OR at the least end the career of a disgusting abused example of society.
Bill
Help Animal Charities while you search the web – http://www.DoGreatGood.com
hey, as a kid those bread bags saved my shoes from getting all wet!
WE MUST GIVE MICHAEL VICK THE SAME CHANCE THAT HE AND THE HUMANE SOCIETY OF THE UNITED STATES GAVE HIS DOGS. NONE!
Second Chance? Hell no! He’s got to go! Neither the Humane Society of the United States nor Michael Vick were willing to give the dogs a second chance. The list of Eagle Corporate Partners/Sponsors to boycott. http://www.boycottthehumanesociety.org/boycotthsus6.html
I hope you will join us in our boycott against the Humane Society and please do share these urls with your friends and network as long as HSUS is a representative for Michael Vick and he is on the NFL.
Here’s our FB group.
Boycott the Humane Society, the NFL, all their sponsors & Michael Vick!
http://www.facebook.com/group.php?gid=108049904101
HSUS Spokesman Michael Vick: ‘Not My Fault’
http://www.nathanwinograd.com/?p=1789
[HSUS} Riding on Vick’s Bloodstained Coattails
http://www.nathanwinograd.com/?p=1768